[{"data":1,"prerenderedAt":619},["ShallowReactive",2],{"project-28305394":3},{"id":4,"name":5,"line":6,"line_source":7,"title":8,"url":9,"domain":10,"maker":11,"posted_at":12,"year":13,"points":14,"comments":15,"rank_in_year":16,"shown_in_year":17,"top":18,"tier":19,"category":20,"subcategory":21,"format":22,"keywords":23,"reception":29,"sentiment":30,"stance_mix":31,"scored_comments":36,"aspects":37,"strip":46,"post_text":48,"what":49,"said":77,"maker_in_thread":170,"shape":175,"grid":180,"attempts":581,"same_week":582,"maker_shows":39,"maker_hidden":611,"reader_version":612,"card":613},"28305394","59a34eabe31910abfb06f308","NeuralHash Collision Demo","title","Show HN: 59a34eabe31910abfb06f308 – NeuralHash Collision Demo","https:\u002F\u002Fthishashcollisionisnotporn.com","thishashcollisionisnotporn.com","mono-bob",1629917381,2021,339,235,100,2533,4,"legend","security_privacy","perceptual hash collision demo","web_app",[24,25,26,27,28],"neuralhash","hash collision","apple csam","perceptual hash","privacy","roasted",-0.339,{"positive":32,"neutral":33,"mixed":34,"critical":35},5,23,2,32,62,{"idea":38,"execution":40,"privacy":42,"design":44,"docs":45},{"positive":39,"critical":39},1,{"positive":41,"critical":34},0,{"positive":18,"critical":43},29,{"positive":41,"critical":41},{"positive":41,"critical":41},[32,41,47,41,41,41,41,41,41,41,41,41,41,41,41,39,39,34,34,39,39,47,34,34,34,47,39,39,39,41,41,39,41,41,39,39,39,39,18,39],3,null,{"problem":48,"audience":50,"pricing":48,"motivation":61,"time_to_build":48,"stack":66,"openness":75,"stage":76,"team_size":75},{"value":51,"source":52,"evidence":53},"People concerned about Apple's on-device scanning proposal and privacy researchers","inferred",[54,58],{"id":55,"by":56,"text":57},"28305471","smt88","This simple site is a far better demo and explanation of the extreme danger of Apple's proposal than any of the long articles written about it. Thank you for caring enough to put…",{"id":59,"by":11,"text":60},"28311769","Thank you for your kind words. This situation is something close to my heart, I think privacy should be a fundamental right for everyone, and it is essential to inform people.",{"value":62,"source":63,"evidence":64},"Maker wants to inform people that privacy should be a fundamental right","maker",[65],{"id":59,"by":11,"text":60},[67],{"value":68,"source":69,"evidence":70},"ONNX runtime","commenter",[71],{"id":72,"by":73,"text":74},"28305893","nicce","Sigh… All these articles and demos are based on their old release, which is also emulated on onnxruntime. Who knows how they actually use it. We should cool down a little and…","unknown","launched",{"praise":78,"objections":87,"requests":126,"questions":141,"alternatives":156},[79,83],{"value":80,"source":69,"evidence":81},"Demo is a clearer explanation of the danger than long articles",[82],{"id":55,"by":56,"text":57},{"value":84,"source":63,"evidence":85},"Useful for informing people about the proposal",[86],{"id":59,"by":11,"text":60},[88,100,115],{"value":89,"source":63,"evidence":90},"Human review of low-res derivatives could let false positives through",[91,94,97],{"id":92,"by":11,"text":93},"28311890","The fact that they send a visual derivative of the image, such as a low-resolution version, makes the human review process tricky. Because there is, understandably, no actual…",{"id":95,"by":11,"text":96},"28311900","Apple recieves a visual derivative of the image, such as a low-resolution version, for manual review. This makes the human review process tricky. Because there is,…",{"id":98,"by":11,"text":99},"28311924","Not even that. Apple recieves a visual derivative of the image, such as a low-resolution version, for manual review. The downside it that this makes the human review process…",{"value":101,"source":69,"evidence":102},"On-device scanning violates privacy and could be extended for censorship",[103,107,111],{"id":104,"by":105,"text":106},"28305878","echelon","It could flag you as a supporter of Free Hong Kong in China, women's rights in Afghanistan, or maybe just someone who likes gay porn in Russia. Building these types of systems is…",{"id":108,"by":109,"text":110},"28308749","vineyardmike","The point is that its done on our end, not apple's end. Many reasons this is bad. Obviously the \"Slippery slope\" argument around it scanning more in future and being abused by…",{"id":112,"by":113,"text":114},"28305659","umvi","Seems like this CSAM tech could be super useful in China for detecting winnie the pooh or other evidence of thought crime against the regime. Even if Apple doesn't end up rolling…",{"value":116,"source":69,"evidence":117},"Perceptual hashes are susceptible to collisions",[118,122],{"id":119,"by":120,"text":121},"28319780","prophesi","That's just incorrect. From the whitepaper: > Once Apple’s iCloud Photos servers decrypt a set of positive match vouchers for an account that exceeded the match threshold, the…",{"id":123,"by":124,"text":125},"28305755","WesolyKubeczek","Each image on the left has a blob vaguely similar to the highlights in the dog image on the right. Likely the \"perceptual\" algorithm isn't \"perceiving\" contrast the same way…",[127,134],{"value":128,"source":69,"evidence":129},"Make the attack work on the fly for user uploads",[130],{"id":131,"by":132,"text":133},"28305676","drexlspivey","Cool! Now do one where the user uploads the image and it tweaks it to find a collision on the fly.",{"value":135,"source":69,"evidence":136},"Auditable hash database",[137],{"id":138,"by":139,"text":140},"28305617","spuz","Apple have stated that they will make the database of hashes that their system uses auditable by researchers. Does anyone know if that has happened yet? Is it possible to view…",[142,149],{"value":143,"source":69,"evidence":144},"How are collision images found or created",[145],{"id":146,"by":147,"text":148},"28306209","seanbarry","Can somebody please explain to me how one can go about finding images that have collision hashes? Or how you can create an image to have a specific hash?",{"value":150,"source":69,"evidence":151},"Who controls the hash database",[152],{"id":153,"by":154,"text":155},"28306251","DavideNL","> For example, it's possible to detect political campaign posters or similar images on users' devices by extending the database. So who controls the database?",[157,164],{"value":158,"source":69,"evidence":159},"Google and Microsoft cloud hash matching for CSAM",[160],{"id":161,"by":162,"text":163},"28305856","slg","Now let's create one for the hash matching that Google, Microsoft, and other cloud providers use. If your problem with Apple's proposal is the fact they do hash matching (rather…",{"value":165,"source":69,"evidence":166},"Apple's own iCloud scanning",[167],{"id":168,"by":73,"text":169},"28308864","Bugs are kinda slippery slope arguments as well, since they are impossible to prevent or measure with 100% accuracy. These are stopped in human review. (Hopefully) It seems that…",{"comments":18,"answered":34,"key":171},[172,173,174],{"id":92,"text":93},{"id":98,"text":99},{"id":95,"text":96},{"commenters":176,"max_depth":177,"maker_replies":18,"first_comment_mins":178,"lifespan_hours":179},78,14,7,28,[181,183,187,188,190,193,195,198,200,203,206,209,212,215,218,222,226,230,232,235,239,241,243,244,246,249,252,253,256,258,261,263,265,268,270,272,274,276,278,280,281,283,285,288,291,292,295,298,301,303,305,307,311,314,316,318,320,323,324,326,329,332,334,335,337,340,342,345,348,352,354,357,359,362,365,367,369,371,374,377,380,384,386,388,389,392,395,398,402,405,409,414,417,419,423,425,428,430,432,434,436,438,441,443,446,449,452,455,458,460,463,466,469,471,473,475,477,479,481,483,485,487,489,491,493,495,497,499,501,503,505,507,510,512,514,516,519,521,524,527,529,532,535,538,540,544,547,551,554,556,558,560,563,566,568,570,574,577,579],[55,41,32,182,56,41],"project\u002Fpositive\u002Fidea",[184,41,41,185,186,41],"28305593","commenter\u002Fneutral\u002Fnone","aomobile",[72,41,41,185,73,41],[189,41,41,185,105,41],"28305922",[191,41,41,185,192,41],"28305926","JohnJamesRambo",[194,41,41,185,73,41],"28306317",[196,41,41,185,197,41],"28307656","fragmede",[199,41,41,185,73,41],"28307749",[201,41,47,202,109,41],"28306153","project\u002Fneutral\u002Fexecution",[204,41,41,205,56,41],"28306751","other\u002Fneutral\u002Fnone",[207,41,41,205,208,41],"28306843","matheusmoreira",[210,41,41,205,211,41],"28307422","ostenning",[213,41,41,205,214,41],"28308883","hypothesis",[216,41,41,217,154,41],"28310193","other\u002Fneutral\u002Fprivacy",[219,41,41,220,221,41],"28305653","commenter\u002Fcritical\u002Fidea","Natsu",[223,41,41,224,225,41],"28305872","other\u002Fcritical\u002Fprivacy","setr",[227,41,41,228,229,41],"28305983","commenter\u002Fneutral\u002Fprivacy","selsta",[231,41,41,228,109,41],"28306190",[233,41,41,228,234,41],"28306498","axoltl",[236,41,41,237,238,41],"28306667","commenter\u002Fcritical\u002Fprivacy","torstenvl",[240,41,41,228,73,41],"28308340",[242,41,41,228,109,41],"28308761",[108,41,41,224,109,41],[168,41,41,245,73,41],"commenter\u002Fneutral\u002Fperformance",[247,41,41,248,109,41],"28317594","commenter\u002Fcritical\u002Fperformance",[250,41,41,185,251,41],"28309424","snet0",[104,41,41,224,105,41],[254,41,41,185,255,41],"28306877","djrogers",[257,41,41,185,208,41],"28307009",[259,41,41,185,260,41],"28309212","dkonofalski",[262,41,41,185,208,41],"28310602",[264,41,41,185,260,41],"28318685",[266,41,41,224,267,41],"28307981","nullc",[269,41,41,224,120,41],"28305897",[271,41,41,185,260,41],"28308733",[273,41,41,224,120,41],"28308985",[275,41,41,185,260,41],"28309219",[277,41,41,224,120,41],"28309761",[279,41,41,185,260,41],"28318666",[119,41,41,185,120,41],[92,41,41,282,11,39],"project\u002Fcritical\u002Fprivacy",[284,41,41,185,260,41],"28319185",[286,41,41,224,287,41],"28305913","gowld",[289,41,41,228,290,41],"28305964","conception",[98,41,41,282,11,39],[293,41,41,224,294,41],"28306026","mulmen",[296,41,41,205,297,41],"28306231","varispeed",[299,41,41,185,300,41],"28306256","ec109685",[302,41,41,185,294,41],"28306341",[304,41,41,185,221,41],"28306284",[306,41,41,224,294,41],"28307111",[308,41,41,309,310,41],"28307403","other\u002Fcritical\u002Fnone","laurent92",[312,41,41,185,313,41],"28306723","snowwrestler",[315,41,41,224,294,41],"28307090",[317,41,41,224,267,41],"28307934",[319,41,41,309,208,41],"28306908",[321,41,41,185,322,41],"28308324","xadhominemx",[95,41,41,282,11,39],[325,41,41,185,322,41],"28321912",[327,41,41,224,328,41],"28307402","boudin",[330,41,39,282,331,41],"28306126","mfer",[59,41,41,333,11,39],"maker\u002Fpositive\u002Fnone",[112,39,39,282,113,41],[336,39,39,282,124,41],"28305785",[338,39,41,185,339,41],"28305937","vkou",[341,39,41,185,124,41],"28316566",[343,39,39,282,344,41],"28306725","vageli",[346,39,39,282,347,41],"28305919","ribosometronome",[349,39,47,350,351,41],"28306332","project\u002Fneutral\u002Fprivacy","alfalfasprout",[353,39,47,350,109,41],"28306200",[355,39,41,205,356,41],"28306619","frashelaw",[358,39,39,282,73,41],"28307317",[360,39,47,361,267,41],"28308007","project\u002Fmixed\u002Fdesign",[363,39,32,364,73,41],"28308076","project\u002Fpositive\u002Fprivacy",[366,39,39,282,267,41],"28308138",[368,39,41,228,73,41],"28308301",[370,39,39,282,267,41],"28308398",[372,34,41,205,373,41],"28305684","firebaze",[375,34,41,205,376,41],"28305726","kilroy123",[378,34,41,205,379,41],"28306333","dang",[381,34,47,382,383,41],"28306975","project\u002Fmixed\u002Fprivacy","LeifCarrotson",[385,47,39,282,267,41],"28308036",[387,47,39,282,214,41],"28308773",[131,18,47,202,132,41],[390,18,47,202,391,41],"28305806","grepfru_it",[393,32,47,202,394,41],"28305890","CodesInChaos",[396,32,47,202,397,41],"28307221","anishathalye",[399,400,39,282,401,41],"28307319",6,"spoonjim",[403,178,32,364,404,41],"28306762","advisedwang",[406,178,39,407,408,41],"28314181","project\u002Fcritical\u002Fexecution","pnt12",[410,411,47,412,413,41],"28305682",8,"project\u002Fneutral\u002Fnone","spullara",[415,411,47,412,416,41],"28305827","cucumb3rrelish",[123,418,39,407,124,41],9,[420,421,47,202,422,41],"28306042",10,"aliabd",[153,424,47,350,154,41],11,[426,424,39,282,427,41],"28306386","colinmhayes",[429,424,41,228,154,41],"28310164",[431,424,47,350,154,41],"28311683",[433,424,47,350,416,41],"28306469",[146,435,47,202,147,41],12,[437,435,47,202,267,41],"28307504",[439,435,41,440,147,41],"28311883","commenter\u002Fpositive\u002Fnone",[138,442,47,350,139,41],13,[444,442,47,445,416,41],"28305759","project\u002Fneutral\u002Fdocs",[447,442,47,445,448,41],"28305793","bnj",[450,177,39,282,451,41],"28306037","nonbirithm",[453,177,39,282,454,41],"28306076","bequanna",[456,177,39,282,457,41],"28306329","sharken",[459,177,39,282,454,41],"28306383",[461,177,39,282,462,41],"28306087","djbebs",[464,177,39,282,465,41],"28306116","totony",[467,177,39,282,468,41],"28306121","least",[470,177,41,228,162,41],"28306255",[472,177,41,228,468,41],"28306321",[474,177,41,228,162,41],"28306400",[476,177,41,228,468,41],"28306549",[478,177,41,228,162,41],"28306728",[480,177,41,228,468,41],"28306870",[482,177,41,228,162,41],"28307175",[484,177,41,228,468,41],"28307644",[486,177,41,185,451,41],"28307859",[488,177,41,185,468,41],"28308093",[490,177,41,228,451,41],"28308352",[492,177,39,282,468,41],"28309595",[494,177,41,185,162,41],"28308224",[496,177,41,237,468,41],"28309432",[498,177,41,217,451,41],"28307355",[500,177,41,237,468,41],"28307832",[502,177,41,228,451,41],"28308191",[504,177,41,237,468,41],"28310020",[506,177,41,205,451,41],"28306621",[508,177,41,237,509,41],"28306358","Koffiepoeder",[511,177,41,228,162,41],"28306431",[513,177,41,309,297,41],"28306133",[515,177,41,309,267,41],"28307661",[517,177,39,282,518,41],"28306134","dvt",[520,177,41,228,451,41],"28306352",[522,177,41,237,523,41],"28306540","xboxnolifes",[525,177,47,412,526,41],"28306156","ak391",[528,177,39,282,331,41],"28306206",[530,177,39,282,531,41],"28306230","tw04",[533,177,39,282,534,41],"28306263","yrral",[536,177,47,412,537,41],"28306277","craftinator",[539,177,47,350,154,41],"28306318",[541,177,39,542,543,41],"28306357","project\u002Fcritical\u002Fidea","lisper",[545,177,39,282,546,41],"28306445","throwaway81523",[548,549,41,205,550,41],"28305954",15,"1vuio0pswjnm7",[552,549,47,412,553,41],"28306011","SlowBall",[161,555,41,217,162,41],16,[557,555,39,282,294,41],"28305883",[559,555,41,205,162,41],"28306291",[561,555,41,205,562,41],"28306444","wmf",[564,555,32,364,565,41],"28306823","kristjansson",[567,555,39,282,294,41],"28307000",[569,555,32,364,565,41],"28307860",[571,555,47,572,573,41],"28305884","project\u002Fneutral\u002Fidea","spoiler",[575,555,41,576,162,41],"28305993","commenter\u002Fneutral\u002Fidea",[578,555,39,282,451,41],"28306248",[580,555,39,282,267,41],"28307616",[],[583,587,592,597,602,607],{"id":584,"name":585,"points":586,"category":20},"28229291","Neural-hash-collider",623,{"id":588,"name":589,"points":590,"category":591},"28244744","Duedilly.io",181,"finance_crypto",{"id":593,"name":594,"points":595,"category":596},"28301374","Exatorrent",179,"dev_tools",{"id":598,"name":599,"points":600,"category":601},"28286199","easyzoom.com",137,"ai",{"id":603,"name":604,"points":605,"category":606},"28301262","WebCrate",110,"productivity",{"id":608,"name":609,"points":610,"category":596},"28302304","ReGit",96,false,"v2",{"id":614,"name":5,"line":6,"ai":611,"cat":20,"year":13,"points":14,"comments":15,"rec":29,"s":615,"top":18,"kw":616,"maker":11,"domain":10,"tier":19,"attempts":41,"strip":617,"url":9,"mix":618,"praise":80,"objection":89,"sub":21},28305394,-0.34,[24,25,26,27,28],"5030000000000001122113222311100100111141",[32,33,34,35],1794036610563]