[{"data":1,"prerenderedAt":279},["ShallowReactive",2],{"project-39242244":3},{"id":4,"name":5,"line":6,"line_source":7,"title":8,"url":9,"domain":10,"maker":11,"posted_at":12,"year":13,"points":14,"comments":15,"rank_in_year":16,"shown_in_year":17,"top":18,"tier":19,"category":20,"subcategory":21,"format":22,"keywords":23,"reception":28,"sentiment":29,"stance_mix":30,"scored_comments":34,"aspects":35,"strip":42,"post_text":44,"what":45,"said":68,"maker_in_thread":136,"shape":145,"grid":150,"attempts":241,"same_week":242,"maker_shows":147,"maker_hidden":272,"reader_version":273,"card":274},"39242244","ramrecovery","Simple demo of a cold boot attack using a Raspberry Pi","title","Show HN: Simple demo of a cold boot attack using a Raspberry Pi","https:\u002F\u002Fgithub.com\u002Fanfractuosity\u002Framrecovery","github.com","anfractuosity",1706979785,2024,127,38,676,3515,20,"notable","security_privacy","cold boot attack demo","other",[24,25,26,27],"cold boot attack","ram forensics","memory remanence","raspberry pi","curious",-0.3,{"positive":31,"neutral":32,"mixed":31,"critical":33},0,6,4,10,{"performance":36,"execution":38,"idea":39,"privacy":41},{"positive":31,"critical":37},2,{"positive":31,"critical":31},{"positive":31,"critical":40},1,{"positive":31,"critical":40},[31,31,40,31,43,31,31,31,43,31,40,40,43,40,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,31,43,31,31,43,43,31,31,31,31,31],3,null,{"problem":46,"audience":44,"pricing":44,"motivation":44,"time_to_build":44,"stack":57,"openness":67,"stage":67,"team_size":67},{"value":47,"source":48,"evidence":49},"Shows that RAM contents can survive briefly after power loss, so sensitive data may be recoverable.","inferred",[50,54],{"id":51,"by":52,"text":53},"39243272","Cheer2171","It is important to note they could access an image in the memory up to 0.75 seconds after cutting power, but after 1.0 seconds everything had completely decayed. This sounds less…",{"id":55,"by":11,"text":56},"39243301","I wasn't able to automate the use of the freeze spray alas, but I believe that did let me access data after more significant durations. With the freeze spray I did also manage to…",[58,63],{"value":59,"source":60,"evidence":61},"Raspberry Pi 4","maker",[62],{"id":55,"by":11,"text":56},{"value":64,"source":60,"evidence":65},"DDR4 RAM",[66],{"id":55,"by":11,"text":56},"unknown",{"praise":69,"objections":78,"requests":98,"questions":106,"alternatives":120},[70],{"value":71,"source":72,"evidence":73},"Nice work on the demo","commenter",[74],{"id":75,"by":76,"text":77},"39244385","badrabbit","Nice work. There is TME for intel, does anyone know its implementation state and if something similar exists for arm?…",[79,90],{"value":80,"source":72,"evidence":81},"One bit flip does not necessarily make a recovered key useless, so the risk is debated",[82,86],{"id":83,"by":84,"text":85},"39244401","oskarw85","It's nice to recover an image but encryption keys are not that. One bit flip and it's game over. This experiment is more useful for human-readable document forensics than…",{"id":87,"by":88,"text":89},"39252187","ivancho","There is extensive research on key finding attacks. Often they only need 30% of the bits. Things can be sped up by exploiting entropy - keys are really random, unlike most of the…",{"value":91,"source":72,"evidence":92},"0.75 seconds of residual power seems too long for RAM without refresh",[93,94],{"id":51,"by":52,"text":53},{"id":95,"by":96,"text":97},"39243353","NavinF","0.75 seconds without cooling. I would not expect \"residual power\" to last for 0.75 seconds. Even if it did, RAM has to actively be refreshed by the memory controller. (DDR…",[99],{"value":100,"source":72,"evidence":101},"Test different delays and ambient temperatures",[102],{"id":103,"by":104,"text":105},"39243393","yonatan8070","It would be interesting to do this with different delays to see how the noise level increases as the delay increases, then once you have a bunch of images recovered, make an…",[107,114],{"value":108,"source":72,"evidence":109},"How to prevent cold boot attacks",[110],{"id":111,"by":112,"text":113},"39243037","alana314","I'd never even heard of cold boot attacks. Is there any prevention of this?",{"value":115,"source":72,"evidence":116},"Whether freezer cooling would give similar results",[117],{"id":118,"by":104,"text":119},"39243407","What results would you expect to get if you simply put the whole setup in a regular freezer? Or if you just tried it during winter",[121,129],{"value":122,"source":72,"evidence":123},"Intel TME and AMD full memory encryption",[124,128],{"id":125,"by":126,"text":127},"39243131","dist-epoch","That is correct, AMD Zen4 (Ryzen 7000) supports transparent full memory encryption. It also supports more granular memory encryption, for example to prevent the host accessing VM…",{"id":75,"by":76,"text":77},{"value":130,"source":72,"evidence":131},"TCG firmware RAM wipe on boot",[132],{"id":133,"by":134,"text":135},"39245300","mjg59","This is mitigated by a Trusted Computing Group feature - at boot, the OS sets a non-volatile flag, and clears it again on clean shutdown after wiping any sensitive material from…",{"comments":33,"answered":43,"key":137},[138,139,142],{"id":55,"text":56},{"id":140,"text":141},"39243830","It sounds like a typical freezer cools to around -20C, I think the freezer spray I used directly on DDR chip, claims to chill to around -50C, but not sure how much the surface…",{"id":143,"text":144},"39243427","That's something they did in one of the original papers - \"Lest We Remember: Cold Boot Attacks on Encryption Keys\" by Halderman et al, with an earlier version of DDR, think it…",{"commenters":146,"max_depth":147,"maker_replies":33,"first_comment_mins":148,"lifespan_hours":149},25,8,67,66,[151,153,157,159,161,163,164,168,171,175,177,178,180,184,187,190,193,195,197,200,203,205,208,210,213,215,217,218,220,221,222,223,227,229,231,232,235,238],[133,31,31,152,134,31],"other\u002Fneutral\u002Fprivacy",[154,31,31,155,156,31],"39246575","commenter\u002Fneutral\u002Fprivacy","goriloser",[51,40,40,158,52,31],"project\u002Fcritical\u002Fperformance",[55,40,31,160,11,40],"maker\u002Fneutral\u002Fexecution",[118,40,43,162,104,31],"project\u002Fneutral\u002Fexecution",[140,40,31,160,11,40],[165,40,31,166,167,31],"39248680","other\u002Fneutral\u002Fnone","jacquesm",[169,40,31,166,170,31],"39249737","azalemeth",[172,40,43,173,174,31],"39256387","project\u002Fneutral\u002Fperformance","TeMPOraL",[176,40,31,166,170,31],"39272850",[95,40,40,158,96,31],[83,37,40,179,84,31],"project\u002Fcritical\u002Fidea",[181,37,43,182,183,31],"39244586","project\u002Fneutral\u002Fidea","PrimeMcFly",[185,37,40,186,126,31],"39244628","project\u002Fcritical\u002Fprivacy",[188,37,31,155,189,31],"39245968","tczMUFlmoNk",[191,37,31,155,192,31],"39246138","IanCal",[194,37,31,155,126,31],"39246299",[196,37,31,155,126,31],"39246381",[198,37,31,155,199,31],"39246943","cloudbonsai",[201,37,31,155,202,31],"39245231","orlp",[204,37,31,155,52,31],"39245856",[206,37,31,155,207,31],"39248681","krab",[209,37,31,155,88,31],"39249020",[211,37,31,155,212,31],"39248155","matheusmoreira",[214,37,31,155,88,31],"39249097",[216,37,31,155,212,31],"39251218",[87,37,31,155,88,31],[219,37,31,155,212,31],"39255943",[103,43,43,162,104,31],[143,43,31,160,11,40],[75,33,31,152,76,31],[224,225,43,182,226,31],"39244145",5,"RecycledEle",[111,32,43,228,112,31],"project\u002Fneutral\u002Fprivacy",[230,32,31,152,11,40],"39243050",[125,32,31,152,126,31],[233,32,31,152,234,31],"39243087","Wool2662",[236,32,31,152,237,31],"39243315","bri3d",[239,32,31,152,240,31],"39245799","sneak",[],[243,248,253,258,263,268],{"id":244,"name":245,"points":246,"category":247},"39288039","One Minute Focus",741,"consumer_social",{"id":249,"name":250,"points":251,"category":252},"39263854","Atopile",595,"dev_tools",{"id":254,"name":255,"points":256,"category":257},"39261486","Natural-SQL-7B",362,"ai",{"id":259,"name":260,"points":261,"category":262},"39214743","filippo.io\u002Fmlkem768",315,"languages",{"id":264,"name":265,"points":266,"category":267},"39232572","Minesweeper Twist",293,"games",{"id":269,"name":270,"points":271,"category":247},"39260760","Random Hacker News",267,false,"v2",{"id":275,"name":5,"line":6,"ai":272,"cat":20,"year":13,"points":14,"comments":15,"rec":28,"s":29,"top":18,"kw":276,"maker":11,"domain":10,"tier":19,"attempts":31,"strip":277,"url":9,"mix":278,"praise":71,"objection":80,"sub":21},39242244,[24,25,26,27],"00103000301131000000000000003003300000",[31,32,31,33],1794036649184]