Private Forms

Security and privacy

encrypted forms

SHOW HN2015

60points
41comments
#469of 2,565 in 2015
Top 19%of 2015 by points

How HN took it

MixedNo clear lean

2 positive, 11 neutral or asking, 0 mixed, 10 critical, out of 23 comments about the project. Thread score -0.18.

Privacy: 0 for, 7 againstExecution: 1 for, 2 againstIdea: 0 for, 1 against

The thread, comment by comment

Each row is a top-level comment and its replies, in HN's order. Select a cell to open that comment on HN.

positive neutral or mixed critical about another commenter or something else the maker

What HN said

What people liked

  • Simple, easy to use product

    From 1 comment
    • You have an interesting product. I like the simplicity of it both in terms of ease-of-use and ability to make it more secure later. Are you intending to keep this thing going or…
      nickpsecurity on HN
  • Good idea for privacy-conscious forms

    From 1 comment
    • Hi, HN! Founder here (on my 2nd "startup"). I strongly believe in the need for private communication, especially in the context of doctors-patients, clients-lawyers or…
      sjs382 on HN

Objections

  • Client-side JavaScript still requires trusting the server to deliver honest code

    From 3 comments
    • But the person entering form data - how do they know the JavaScript is OK? All users must trust the server to send js that'll encrypt correctly. This isn't visible to users. If…
      MichaelGG on HN
    • It does mean that users must explicitly and totally trust PF. From a customer standpoint, the product might as well encrypt on the server side (immediately discarding the…
      MichaelGG on HN
    • Forget even government attackers. The entire point of the product is to avoid trusting them. Except... you still utterly and totally trust them, as there's no way to verify what…
      MichaelGG on HN
  • Claims of no-trust are overstated; submissions are visible to the server before encryption if JS is compromised

    From 1 comment
    • > this way, not even we can view the form submissions That's not true. PF cannot view the submission /after it has been submitted, assuming your javascript does what you say it…
      bramblerose on HN
  • Datacenter security FAQ is confusing given client-side encryption

    From 2 comments
    • The FAQ describes how the data center is using super-sophisticated security. Why is this necessary if the data is encrypted at the client? (perhaps I'm missing something about…
      locacorten on HN
    • I'm sorry but I beg to differ. Encryption is a very powerful tool -- the whole point of doing encryption at the client is that we don't care about data center security any more.…
      locacorten on HN
  • Form validation missing and example form 404s

    From 1 comment

Requests

  • Clarify trust model and limitations in FAQ

    From 2 comments
    • I like your answer because you're describing a new threat model: an adversary tries to subvert the encryption process. Their service does not protect against such a threat.…
      locacorten on HN
    • May I suggest you make this clear in the FAQ? In its current format, the FAQ makes it a big deal out of it without explaining that it's an additional security measure and that…
      locacorten on HN
  • Add form validation

    From 1 comment
  • Add warrant canary

    From 1 comment
    • That's an interesting (and accurate) point. An interested user could verify the source of the embedded page, and ensure that it doesn't change. This also doesn't protect the…
      sjs382 on HN

Questions

  • How do users verify keys and JavaScript are not tampered with?

    From 2 comments
    • How do users verify keys are correct and not being sent to your server?
      MichaelGG on HN
    • But the person entering form data - how do they know the JavaScript is OK? All users must trust the server to send js that'll encrypt correctly. This isn't visible to users. If…
      MichaelGG on HN
  • Is the project open source?

    From 2 comments
    • Are you using any open source projects? I'm deeply curious about how you're doing the encryption and am usually skeptical of in-browser cryptography, though I'd love to be able…
      pipework on HN
    • Looks like it uses this internally: https://github.com/keybase/kbpgp Also, what's this? https://github.com/keybase/kbpgp/blob/master/LICENSE
      daveloyall on HN

Alternatives named

  • JotForm encrypted forms

    From 1 comment
    • Another example to how good ideas come out at the same time! We have just recently released the exact same feature. Not all JotForm users use it but the users who use this…
      aytekin on HN
  • Mailvelope

    From 1 comment
    • Cool. A few thoughts: 1. On the front page "Only you have the encryption key" could be confusing to folks new to PGP, consider instead "Only you have the decryption key". Then…
      bgibson on HN

Category, keywords, summaries and labels on this page were made by AI (Thread Reader v2) and not checked by hand. Each point links to the comments it came from.

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